After reading the guidelines for such groups as Novae Militiae and the (seemingly) now defunct Milites Normannorum, I have concluded that my (nominally) SCA persona is definitely lacking. I cannot suspend disbelief in myself enough to want to continue a persona that would have been of European knightly lineage. I will therefore change my persona to that of a sergeant in the Templars.

I have already purchased the black and brown wool necessary to make the clothing and other cloth kit I require. My lady wife has agreed to sew a linen gambeson for me (thank you, LinenWeb!), and I'm making myself a short lamellar corselet of leather. I've a wooden heater, a conical helmet, and turnshoes.

Does anyone have any other suggestions of items I could use?

Robert Coleman, Jr.

Those who beat their swords into plowshares end up plowing for those who don't.

When you open the door, the world gets LARGE!

Mostly I need to get myself disciplined to doing my persona in the "first person". Quite a lot of what I need is in the Rule of the Temple, but I will need some ideas of 12th-century thought. In short, how would a 12th century man, with a strong African/Sudanese ancestry (likely an expatriate from Fatimid Egypt) survive in a group mostly run by 12th century Franks who (most likely) believe that a man of dark skin color is (at best) suspect of loyalty and (at worst) a spy?

Robert Coleman, Jr.

Because that's the only way a black man can do a Templar persona.

Robert Coleman, Jr.

Those who beat their swords into plowshares end up plowing for those who don't.

[This message has been edited by Templar Bob (edited 10-03-2000).]

The race issue in reenacting is as sensitive as it is elsewhere. How do you say "no" to someone who's physical features might stretch credibility?

I'm thinking Sudan need not be the only solution for Bob to be in a Templar group. A long story might be required to explain the presence of a Sudanese in a camp of Franks. And it'd hardly be typical. In reenacting, the simplest explaination is the best.

I've never met Bob in person, so I don't know how dark his skin is, but with the genetic mixing that's gone on here in the US, perhaps there's another explaination possible.

My suggestion is to use the territorial conquest, loss, and reconquest between Europeans & the Moors in the Mediterranean. That's bound to result in some assimilation and genetic mixing. It needen't be a recent event, maybe it happened a few generations back. Perhaps some of the old Moorish genes came out "True" generations later. It seems a more likely explaination.

Now to document it...

This is the little bit that I do know of the Sudan. It was the place that provided Fatimid and Ayyubid Egypt with three valuable commodities; gold, ivory and black slaves. It was also (until Saladin) where the Egyptian army got their crack African elite swordsmen, bowmen and spearmen.

The African warriors rebelled against Saladin in favor of the Fatimid caliph, and were ruthlessly put down. From this point onward, Saladin stopped using black mamluks in his armies.

Many of these families fled Egypt for the Sudan, Byzantium and (possibly) the Crusader states. I will bring some documentation later.

While this may not help in your "thought" development, a friend of mine here in New England had some of the same challenges as you seem to be pondering. She, very dark skin, decided to create a family background where she fled Africa to Italy as gold merchants. Hence her mixing in with the Italian/medieval culture. Now I'm not suggesting hang up your blade and sell gold, but the "Med" was a very busy trading place, and slaves or no, I would think that there would be a mix of individuals in any port as there are today. Maybe you could use this as a start for your family background and add that you decided to try your luck as a Templar? I have trouble believing they (Templar's) were a truely homogeneous group... And the Templar's certainly had their dealings with financing and wealth.

FvH

quote:

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Originally posted by Peder:
[first off everything I discuss is from an academic point of view. Its not intended to be offensive in any way, but sometimes things come out badly when you just blurt them out]

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As iron sharpens iron, so does one man sharpen his brother. No problem.

Jeff asks a good question. When traveling from Africa up through N. Africa and up into Europe skin color change is mostly a gradual thing with a few geographic boundies like the Sahara that make differences stand out.[/QUOTE]

...which can make this process easier.

Lets break this down into steps assuming you go with the Sudan.

(1)Your life in the Sudan assuming you were born there, otherwise why is your family from the Sudan but not living there?[/QUOTE]

The Fatimid sultans moved whole families to Cairo so that their men could serve in the Egyptian army. They garrisoned a citadel near the Nile there.

(2)How did you get out of the Sudan or what are the circumstances for your leaving where you are and going to the Crusader states?[/QUOTE]

When the (Shiite) Sudani Fatimid guards staged the revolt against Saladin, he ruthlessly put the revolt down, executing the rebels. He further caused those who survived to be driven out of Egypt. They could not return home to the Sudan, which was part of the Egyptian Sultanate, so they would naturally flee to Syria. Some would end up in either Syrian Muslim, Byzantine or Crusader service.

The only overland route there would be through the Crusader States.

(3)Why did you switch sides? Religious? Political? No matter what even if you choose a political you would have to be a closet muslim to be a templar.[/QUOTE]

There were conversions on both sides, usually based on the simple expediency of being defeated. The reasoning was that the winner's God was better.

(4)How did you become a Templar and how long have you been one?[/QUOTE]

There were many Muslim slaves, captured in combat against the Templars. He could very possibly converted then, to much scepticism. He would have been a Templar for nearly twenty years.

I'll stop with just those for now. and ask another question. How old are you? There is a big difference between say someone who is 20 and someone who is 40 and how they got where they are. If your younger inorder to be a serjeant you would probobly have ended up with the templars younger in order to overcome the bias against you. And it has a major affect on all the questions above.[/QUOTE]

I'm 41 as of last Wednesday, and I tend to play my persona real-time.

Hope this helps,

Robert Coleman, Jr.

The recipies look downright tasty! Especially that herb and meat pie. I'm going to ask my wife to try to make that one!

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-Aaron Miaullis, SCAer with Authenticity Leanings (yes, it's not an oxymoron... maybe...)

(battle_of_wisby@yahoo.com)

[This message has been edited by Aaron Miaullis (edited 10-04-2000).]

I'm actually getting off my butt, getting started with getting a Templar sergeant's kit together. Could I get some more specific standards for daywear as worn by members of Novae Militiae? Glen K? Anyone?

(Robert's voice echoing in the void)

quote:

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Originally posted by JeffJ:
I'ts posted on their website.
http://www.cloudnet.com/~drgnfire/novae-militiae.htm

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Jeff J:

Yeah, I know...but I need specifics. I can do the chausses, braies and undertunic---I can order those from Gwen! But I need to know the following:

1. What pattern for the habit tunic?

2. What pattern for the cross?

3. What pattern for the hooded cope?

4. May I substitute a gardecorp for the garnache?

5. What matter of headgear (in addition to a
linen coif)?

As far as arms and armour goes, I'm going with the Regle du Temple in that my equipment will be "according to the wealth of the house", and include "Saracen arms". As a converted infidel, perhaps I have some latitude here?

Awaiting your response.

I like requiring the hair be cut- that's something some of our guys do and it really helps the impression.

Problem is, when dealing the patterns for stuff that old, patterns are usually anyone's guess. We had a bear of a time documenting Norman stuff & developing the simplest pattern. I'm sure Gwen can attest to how tough it is.

They've only been around a couple of years. Brian was in Milites & when we started our "prolonged period of rest", he started the group. The guidelines are about as stringent as we had in MN, but adjusted to date. I'm sure the sources are as well documented as they can be with scarce decent artwork & scarcer surviving originals.

quote:

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Originally posted by JeffJ:
Well, Ask them for patterns! Brian Gerring does most of their co-ordinating & he'd probably share the info.

I'll try by way of their page info e-mail, then.

Problem is, when dealing the patterns for stuff that old, patterns are usually anyone's guess. We had a bear of a time documenting Norman stuff & developing the simplest pattern. I'm sure Gwen can attest to how tough it is.

Linen and wool doesn't survive the ages very well, I'm afraid! Why didn't some obliging Irish Templar sergeant slip into a bog so we could study his kit?

They've only been around a couple of years. Brian was in Milites & when we started our "prolonged period of rest", he started the group. The guidelines are about as stringent as we had in MN, but adjusted to date. I'm sure the sources are as well documented as they can be with scarce decent artwork & scarcer surviving originals.

I communicated with Mr. Gerring once about two years ago regarding Milites Normannorum. He'd sent the standards, and I was enthused about getting involved when suddenly, I stopped getting e-mail responses.

Haircuts can really make a difference. A couple of our guys used to do the "Norman shave" of the back of the head. It looker so "period". I always chickened out (citing job related reasons) & just wore my coif all day.

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It's not as hard for a black man to tonsure. I merely need to either shave my head, or get a "high and tight".

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Robert Coleman, Jr.
The Noble Companie and Order of St. Maurice
Those who beat their swords into plowshares end up plowing for those who don't.

[This message has been edited by Templar Bob (edited 01-10-2001).]

Templar Bob

Just shoot me an e-mail and I will try and answer your questions to the best of my ability.

Gwen

Our group is rather newly formed, but a good deal of the research was brought over from MN by Brian Gerring. However, as new information is gathered and interpreted we quickly apply it to our standards.

The hair cutting is one of my favorites as well. Also the requirement of facial hair. The only problem is that there are three different types of hair tonsure available to us; shaving the entire head, shaving everything in front of the ears, or having the monks ring. I have opted for the entire head.

Let me know what your thoughts are on some of the interpretations of the Rule specifically.

JeffJ

Brian does not do most of our co-ordinating. Everything is done as a group as democratically as possible. Also, Brian did not start this group. It was the brainchild of Jesse Bailey and myself.

Also, in spite of the name, the connection between MN & NM is one member & the legacy research. Credit for a great deal of the MN research goes to Tom Ball. He copyrighted a great deal of his work, and I've always thought it should have been published.

Either way, NM is a good looking group.

Replied by e-mail.