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Author Topic: Cost of Authenticity
Petrus
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Member # 531

posted 02-25-2004 01:23 AM     Profile for Petrus     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Here is a break down of various pieces of military equiptment for an archer in the 3/4 of the 15th century. The reason an archer is chosen is because about 3/4 of English and French forces were armed as archers in that period and about 1/2 of Burgundian forces were in that period.

They are broken down into 3 level with totals for the level.

Indian made Sallet: $145
Practical Hand-and-a Half Sword: $130.00
Oak longbow: $80
Butted Mail Shirt: $130

Total $485


Czech made Sallet: $240
Lutel Sword: $330
Ash longbow: $250
Indian rivited mail shirt: $450

Total $1270

American made sallet: $600
Arms and Armour Sword: $560
Yew longbow: $600
Forth rivited Shirt: $1195

Total $2955


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Jeff Johnson
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posted 02-25-2004 06:37 AM     Profile for Jeff Johnson   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I'd start here as a mix of acceptable authenticity & budget:

Czech made Sallet: $240
Lutel Sword: $330
Ash longbow: $250
Arrows: $100
Home-made Jack: $50

Total $970

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Geoffrey Bourrette
Man At Arms


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Strongbow
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posted 02-25-2004 04:27 PM     Profile for Strongbow     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I'm not a big fan of Lutel's blades (I like the hilt work though). What else would you suggest in that price range? Del Tin? Some of the newer (e.g. higher quality) Windlass? I monitor the Sword Forum site and there seems to be a wide variety of opinion on lower-end to mid-range swords.

Strongbow


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Jeff Johnson
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posted 02-25-2004 08:00 PM     Profile for Jeff Johnson   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I have a four or five of each and have handled several more. I consider the Lutel & Del Tin Blades to be roughly equivalent. DT's have a slight edge in historical configuration on more items, Lutel have a better finish, are believed to be a bit tougher and come with a scabbard (which needs to have changes made to it to be more adequate). Just my opinion.

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Geoffrey Bourrette
Man At Arms


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Petrus
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posted 02-25-2004 11:52 PM     Profile for Petrus     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Jeff Johnson:

Home-made Jack: $50


Having never made one anyone know how many hours of work making one is?


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Wolf
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posted 02-26-2004 09:36 AM     Profile for Wolf   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
i'm making one right now. the longest time thing is cutting it out and then hand stitching the quilting. (i havent got that far yet i'll let you know the time etc when one gets done. its not hard at all. surprised we dont see more on teh fields

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Chuck Russell


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Gobae
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posted 02-26-2004 01:01 PM     Profile for Gobae   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
If you're going to throw in homemade stuff you might as well include the long bow.

Ash Stave - $30
Draw Knife - $30
Rasp - $15
Cabinet Scraper (set) - $20

Total $95 & 8-10 Hours of your time. (Less if you have some power tools.

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Gobae - The Blacksmith
Historic Strides Blog
Ancient Celtic Clans


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Strongbow
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posted 03-02-2004 12:12 PM     Profile for Strongbow     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Aren't Lutel's blades all of lenticualr cross-section?

A glance at their site and the few I have handled, have left me with the impression that they only have a few blade blanks that they put different fullers in and hilt up differently. Maybe a bit unfair, but that's my impression. Lovely hilt work though.

I'd love an A&A piece, though I'd doubt I'd ever want to bang it up. I have an upgraded MRL "Black Prince", maybe Ill use it for banging around and get the A&A piece for show some day

Strongbow


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Alan F
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posted 04-10-2004 07:46 AM     Profile for Alan F   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Is there a link to the lutel site available?
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chef de chambre
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posted 04-10-2004 09:51 AM     Profile for chef de chambre   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Hi Alan,

Here's the link.
http://www.lutel.cz/index2e.htm

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Bob R.


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Martin
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posted 05-07-2004 04:19 PM     Profile for Martin     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
An alternative to the mentioned swordmakers is for one Mark Vickers http://www.stgeorgearmoury.co.uk/
he does great work, and can do exact copies of sent in refs.
I myself have a "long knife" or single edge single hand german style sword which is exactly made like the referance I gave him. It is wonderfully light and still will easily chop fire wood.
If you are looking at high end stuff, I would recomend Peter Johnsson from Sweden, his work is really fantastic and a lot of the Company of Saint George members are saving to get a sword from him! http://bjorn.foxtail.nu/handsmitt.htm
look under Peter Johnsson, his page is unfortunaly only in swedish, but he does speak english.

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Verpa es, qui istuc leges. Non es fidenter scripto!


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gregory23b
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posted 06-13-2005 05:42 PM     Profile for gregory23b   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Petrus, I would save the money spent on the mail shirt, not a lot of good on its own and pay someone to make a jack ;-) seriously.

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history is in the hands of the marketing department - beware!


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Gordon
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posted 06-13-2005 06:30 PM     Profile for Gordon   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Swords designed by Peter Johnsson are available through Albion Swords as a part of their Museum Line. They have a great reputation, and their products are stunning, in both quality and historical accuracy. I've handled a number of them (they are wonderful) and plan on eventually purchasing a few at some point in the future. However, I'll admit that presently my own swords are A&A and ATrim products. Here's the link to Albion:
http://albionarmorers.com/

Cheers,

Gordon

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"After God, we owe our victory to our Horses"


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Thomas james hayman
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posted 06-14-2005 12:16 AM     Profile for Thomas james hayman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Yew longbow: $600


Yew longbow $600!!!. a yew LOG costs me about 13GBP or roughly $22. a day of splitting and rough forming, another day of tillering and i have a bow.

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The allotment spot
http://tomsallotment.blogspot.com/


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Friedrich
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posted 06-14-2005 10:54 PM     Profile for Friedrich   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
A researched yew longbow can easily be $600. They can run to $1000. And the yew comes from here in the US!
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Thomas james hayman
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posted 06-15-2005 10:54 AM     Profile for Thomas james hayman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
fair enough, researched is different to 'a bow' not a mere heath reconstruction.

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The allotment spot
http://tomsallotment.blogspot.com/


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Peter Lyon
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posted 07-16-2005 06:08 PM     Profile for Peter Lyon   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
What about the clothes and accoutrements? Shoes, leggings, underwear, arming doublet, head covering, belts, purse, dagger, etc? You'll get very cold just wearing a mail shirt.

I've looked into the costs of longbows before, and you need to remember a couple of things. There's more to making a bow that combines the heart and sapwood in one stave, than just cutting up a yew log. Ideally, it is grown specifically for bow making, tended for years, then seasoned before the bow is made. You are also not just paying for the bowyers time, but their expertise. This is a specialist craft and takes years of work to be able to make a reliable bow that meets its potential. Sure you can get cheap bows, but quality costs.


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