Reenactors have their fun in a different way. They build their kits and personas to portray someone who did, or might have, existed. Their emphasis is on understanding history. There's a vast amount of research involved, and many groups require a high degree of documentation before they will allow a member to bring a new item into camp. For these people, the fun is in doing it "right".

The problem is, Reenactors expect the SCA folks to share their values and want to do it "Right". Many can't understand that many SCA people don't care about those micro-details the Reenactors cherish. So, the Reenactors are seen as preachy elitist snobs by the SCAdians. SCAdians who don't have any desire to do it "right" are seen as a bunch of prancing farbs in polyester and duct tape claiming to be "Lord Penultimate, who is, by the way, authentic in his portrayal of medieval nobility in every conceivable way".

Plus, a few SCAdians proclaim that what the organization as a whole does is historically accurate and educational. This may be true for some minority, but the majority isn't "authentic". This claim to authenticity really irritates the Reenactors. The woman who spent years researching, buying hard to find materials and hand-sewing all of her clothes gets understandably miffed when someone in a polyester dress, purchased at the renfair, claims her dress is just as authentic.

This is aggravated when people on either side of the authenticity fence are insensitive to the others and don't recognize the difference in goals. Reenactors may make sweeping judgements and what are perceived as crass derogatory comments without thinking. Or, like any scholar, may be inflexible in listening to differing opinions from "mere novices". A gentleman I know, well-respected in both the SCA & Reenactor worlds recently told me a story about how he was in a Museum, looking at some leather finds cataloged as "footwear" when he spied an oval piece of leather that he identified as an archer's bracer. The staff dismissed his "inexpert" ID, but descriptions of the museum's new leather book mention an oval bracer. He was waiting to see if he's credited for it's identification in the book, but rather doubts he will.

SCAdians may take the reenactor's comments on how to improve a portrayal or piece of equipment as criticism where none was intended. It takes a lot of tact for someone who spent $2k on a raised armet, made by a top armorer, to discuss helmets with a person who has one from India without seeming patronizing. Unfortunately, few people have that much tact.

Certainly, there are jerks everywhere, but the majority of people mean well. You just have to have tolerance for alternate goals, points of view, and miscommunication. As Jack Nicholson said, just before being disintegrated in "Mars Attacks" - "Can't we all just get along?"

I also think you make many good points Jeff. I know my main problem with the SCA is when they continue the normal preformance and usurp the title or 're-enactment', and now 'living history'. The only thing the SCA re-enacts or re-creates is the SCA, and the living history is the history of the SCA.

Many fine craftsmen are in the SCA, many are fine historians. The orginization as a whole is a Medievaly themed social club, with no emphasis as a whole on authenticity in artifact or in portrayal. To re-enact, one has to be re-enacting a specific event in time, with people who were present at, or most likely to have been at the event. One cannot have people from a thousand year span of history present at a single event, all behaving as the 'persona' they individualy represent, and call it a historical re-enactment. It is to perpatrate a fraud to do do.

It is when this fraud is knowingly commited that I have a beef. Normaly, I think what they do is all well and good - good fun, and whatnot. My other complaint is when a demo is done at a school, with glaring innaccuracies, and it is fraudulently presented to schoolchildren as being an accurate representation of history.

It is a fools errand to try and enforce ones ideas on another orginization - be it the SCA, or a re-enactment or living history group. There are people who do their best to accuratly do a portrayal in the SCA. My hat is off to them for the hostility they often face.

In the same regard, it is a waste of breath for re-enactment groups to complain about them. What they do is not what we do, and our energy would be better expended on making Medieval re-enactment in the United States a more viable proposition. I sincerely believe that those truly concerned with accuracy, or who realize re-enactment can be fun as well will eventually lookm outside of the SCA to do so, as the orginization cannot meet their needs as the same time it caters to the vast majority of content participants.

My sincere hope IS for us to all get along, and I think that both the SCA and Medieval re-enactment/living history would best be served by groups that form based around specific periods of interest in the SCA, and desire authenticity to the point that they participate both with groups outside of the SCA, and function as households within it. I think I see the beginnings of such groups, and I wish them all the best. Only time will tell what the end result will be.

Those who want it, will find it.

Those who don't will not and there is no point in exchanging banter with them.

The biggest problem seems to be the use of the termonology re-enatment, living history, and re-creation.

The SCA often uses these terms in place of each other even in their oficial documentation.

Most people in other organizations do not. To these organizations re-enactment is the process of re-doing a specific event as closely to the origional as possible. ACW groups re-enact the Battle of Gettysburg (and other Civil War battles). While they know that they can never do it %100 they get a great deal of satisfation in attempting to do it as well as they can and continuing to improve on it year after year. The down side of this is that it's repetitave and a groups can easily get into a rut doing the same thing over and over without questioning it and thereby keep makeing the same mistakes.

Living history is generally an attempt to portray the daily life of a specific time and place. There is no set order of events or speicfic characters like a re-eanctment would have. Most Re-enactment groups do living history as well. The down side is that since there are less perameters there is less chance for variation in what's considered an accurate portrayal. Often these groups would rather not do something that can't be documented as widely common than take a chance that they might represent something that is obscure or less common because they don't want to misslead the public (who they often do demostrations for) into believeing that some object or practice was common. Because of the limmited nature of extant artifacts and information that has survived from any historic period limmits the scope of the group itself and the run the risk of becomming a "cookie cutter" group with several coppies of similar re-productions that may or may not have been as common as the group represents. In otherwords by excludeing so much are they really accurately portraying the massive ammount of variation in the period. This makes some time periods and cultures much easier to do than others because of existing information.

Re-creation is a little less defined. In a sense the SCA is re-creation. Building an ogranization that is loosely based on a medieval model and holding medievalish events. While the study of the arts and sciences and history of the period is strongly encouraged it is not required to participate and all levels of skill, knowledge and craftsmanship are present. Re-creating the "Spirit of the Day" is as important to the bulk of the SCA as anything else. Lancellot is an important a role model as the Black Prince to many. The strength of the SCA is that it is very user friedly. Many people join for the socializing, fighting, and fun to later become very serious historians and expert craftspeople. An oppertunity to grow at their own pace that they wouldn't have from a stricter organization. The flip side of this is that some new people come in with the drive to be very authentic and are held back by various impediments and quite often discouraged by apathetic attitudes twards high end authenticity. Many people in the SCA take a very harsh stand against other medieval organizations because they feel the SCA has something for everyone so why doesn't everyone come play under "The Big Tent". Unfortunatly it is clear that the SCA is not an org for everyone and it's borg like mentality often puts off other organizations.

Another type of re-creation is doing an event that likely could have happened during a specific period at a specific place. For instance in the year 1380 there could have been a skirmish between English and French forces in France. Yet another variation which seems to me to be even more rare is useing a specific event as a model and then just seeing where it takes you. For instance re-creation the "Battle of Thirty" with no specific outcome. Putting all the parameters in place much like a war-game or other historic simulation.

I don't think there can be a correct answer to this issue but we arn't getting anywhere beeing asses to each other.

Remember that a number of acamedimics look down on all of us with nearly equal distain claiming that even the best groups are nothing but highly abstract views of the period. Try not to paint the whole of the sca with a wide brush of distain. It does nothing but piss people off. Some of those people are really dedicated and knowledgable and might just have a bit of information that you don't.

Also those of you in the SCA rember that some people do deserve respect for their dedication and expert craftsmanship. If your really dedicated to knowledge it may be worth your while to prove it to these people rather than shakeing your fist at them when they hesitate to help you based on the SCA. And if you don't really care and are confortable with your level of authenticity the way it is then just leave these people alone and try not to misrepresent yourself or your organization.

Duncan

Cross posted to the Armour Archive. Some of your should look over there at LeBrassy's post.

I think we all would.

My comments are these-

1) I don't know how or why this turned into Us vs Them. Many people seem to think "we" hate the SCA. Where did that come from?

2) I can't get behind the idea of cross posting from one board to the other, but I guess it's up to the folks in charge to make that call. It seems like doing so isn't bringing any sort of reapproachment, only a hail of abuse and a widening of the gap.

3) I see a lot of time and effort being expended in rock throwing, when we could be spending time talking about our passions, or movies or something!

Back to the idea of live and let live- Anne Marie is a crossover person who does 15th C reenactment and she plays in the SCA. I should mention (sorry AM, I know you're going to hate me spilling the beans) that she's a Laurel and a Pelican, runs the Ithras for her section of An Tir and is well and widely respected throughout the SCA for her knowledge of medieval cooking. She calls me and tells me about what's going on with her SCA group, and we compare notes and resources obout our 15th C. groups. AM is also my Nice Twin™ and my best friend. We're writing a cookbook together. Who says it's "Us vs Them"???

Now I'm about to spill the beans on myself- I used to be a Tuchuck, a rather high ranking one at that. I moved to CA, or I still might be a Tuchuck. I loved participating because the Tuchux have a strong sense of Self, and I loved the sense of community. I also loved the drum pounding and the silly clothes I still stay in touch with several of my wench-sisters online and guess what folks- the ex-Ubar of the Tuchux and a current clan leader is the one who makes our reproduction pottery!!!. He doesn't think we're a bunch of snots because we want historically documentable stuff. He sees it as a way to expand his repertoire. He is amused by our dedication to research, and he doesn't see it as a slam against the Tuchuck way. Dale and I have been friends for 20 years now!!

IMHO, crossover is FINE.
The SCA is FINE.
Reenactment is FINE.
The renFaire is FINE.
LARP is FINE.

Can we all just get along, or at least leave each other alone if we're not playing the same game???

PLEASE?????

Gwen / Ginevra Francesca Pallucchini / Snowbear...give me a hat, I'll wear it!

As an administrator, I don't want to make ripples in someone else's pond. As a member of their board community, I have a different perspective on partaking in the topics, but do have the capability of being the Devil's Advocate when need be.

However, I think for the sake of good will that we refrain from mentioning specifics, we have seen what can happen. We are better than that . We don't want to use up valuable "real estate" discussing something that has no bearing on what we are trying to do as a Living History Re-enactment community. I want people, no matter what game they are playing, to feel welcome when they come here and not think, "oh gawd another lunatic fringe element or someone who is going to spit on me because I am from "this group"."

We have all worked very hard to get where we are and I for one don't wish to see any hard earned credibility evaporate in a puff of smoke and steam and drive off interested parties who really want to participate but are afraid to because they don't want to get dumped on.

Foster growth and enlightment. Instead of putting negative spin on a post, think how one can encourage without frustrating. Not an easy thing. In some aspects we become the teachers, in other aspects, we are the learners.

Asking a question is the beginning of knowledge and remember, there is NO such thing as a stupid question. Sometimes it might seem that way, but unless the person is joking around, they may really not know the answer and will become discouraged if treated like a child or the village idiot.

I think we can discuss the SCA as a different type of group without everyone resorting to getting defensive or offensive, which I DON'T think Jeff J's post was intended to be. I think we can foster a "cross-cultural" relationship if we meet each person where we are; at face value, and ignore those that don't want to learn or wish to change.

I know some people have been frustrated with the current trends on both boards and I think we can get past it.

People bury your hatchets, preferably in the ground not in the person standing next to you and let's get back on track.

PAX
Fire Stryker

The SCA is indubitably a bigger organization and has been around for much longer. They also tend to pull in new recruits a bit more easily due to their easier standards. At the same time, they depend in great part on research supplied by the more hardcore groups and many of their best people gradually migrate towards these other organizations.

The serious reenactors have higher standards for authenticity and participation, but a significant portion of their recruits come through the SCA. Without the SCA and the other pseudo-medievalists, the living history community would certainly be smaller. The SCA also help support the various businesses that supply period clothing, armor, etc.

I too have concerns over the "authenticity" issue and have moved toward the LH commitment. However, some days I'm just as happy not to worry and go out and enjoy an SCA event.

Both types of groups have much to offer IF YOU LOOK FOR IT. Case in point, I have met one of the most technically experienced, period crossbow shooters (and fletcher) in the SCA here locally. I have appreciated learning more from him WITHOUT the added pressure or distraction of LH. With that experience, I now hope to bring that to the LH side which is what I'm now more interested and learning about (and now that I have a clue as to what I'm doing!)...

One parting thought:

35 years ago the thought of even recreating "court" was unheard of except for the movie industry. Even if we may individually disagree and even disapprove of non LH organizations (and vs), we should recognize that it all comes down to $$ and dedication. Without the combined interest and support of all who look to the distant past, we wouldn't have the films, the renfaires, the museums, the manufacturers (who we depend on) or even the interest and dedication people have given to research (be it clothing, swordplay or period life) and to portraying the past. I offer my thanks to all who take the time to listen, to learn, to think and to teach regardless of what group they belong to. We need ALL of us to share and make the medieval "industry" continue. For if it wasn't for "them", would we be as committed to what "we" do?

FvH (who sits on both sides of the fence)

hauptfrau: It's not that SCAdians think that the LH community hate them. It's just...frustration... The closest example I can find for the experience is if you look at the "Silly questions from the public" thread on this board.

Rarely is a slam/rip/jab/whatever at the SCA truly unique, and there's only so many times you can hear something like "You guys fight with sticks! HaHa!" before it gets annoying.

When you get right down to it, everyone in the SCA has accepted what it is...their reasons are all different, but they all have one. If they don't accept it, they either try to change it and/or move on. After a while, it becomes tiresome to feel that you keep needing to explain yourself to people.

Is this justification for rudeness, accusations, and generally acting pissy? No, but maybe it's a little bit of explanation for what one finds online...
Stephen atte Smythe

I think that Miller, Hob, and Fredrich have all touched on a point that both sides seem to miss at times, that the Medieval Living History and Re-enactment communities owe much to the SCA for their very existance, and the SCA equally owes much to Living History and re-enactment for raising the bar,and research (which many SCAdians do sterling work at themselves). In a way, we are dependent on each other, and I think that both sides resent that from time to time.

Many Medieval Re-enactment groups have sprung out of the SCA (I am not refering to groups such as Adria, ECS, or other chivalric sport societies), as members of the SCA became dissatisfied or frustrated with their pursuit of an authentic portrayal within the Society. Many members of this board have come from such a situation - I am a rarity in not having been a participant in the society - but IT DID inspire me that such things were possible when I first heard of the society when I was twelve years old. I can safetly say that I would never have considered Medieval re-enactment had it not been for the SCA.

I have heard also countless times how members of the SCA have been inspired by re-enactment groups, and the authenticity they achive. One thing for near certain is that many of the finest armourers alive today would never have considered seriously learning their craft, had it not been for the impetus of the Society and it's needs and aspirations. The same is true for the general revival of Medieval crafts here in the States, and to a degree in Europe.

I sincerely believe that the most healthy approach to each other - Re-enactment/Living History and the SCA is to accept each other for what they are, and to look upon each other as potentialy valuable resources to each other.

In this vien, I think that here in the US, the most happy thing to occur that even makes Medieval re-enactment a viable pursuit for those who are interested purely in the medium of re-enactment & Living History, are the cross-over groups such as AM's 15th c. camp.

I see our future in Medieval re-enactment dependent on those groups that cross the boundary - and this is a good thing for both the Society and Medieval re-enactment. The Society, as pointed out is a large and well established orginization that is easy for newcomers to join - even those with only a mild interest in Medieval History. Frankly, I am well aware how intimidating it is for people to consider re-enactment - even in 'easier periods' to get started in. The SCA allows people to join with ease, without the fear & percieved pressure.

The Re-enactment community allows a household within the SCA interested in authenticity a venue to try outside the orginization for those who wish to pursue authenticity to a level difficult for a variety of reasons to achieve in the Society.
The Re-enactment community would benefit (will benifit I pray) immensely from those household, companies, or what have you that are members of the SCA - every group that is willing to try out Re-enactment as we know it makes Medieval re-enactment a more viable proposition.

It would be the height of folly to spurn those people coming from within the society who wish to participate with us. Conversely, the Society would benefit from these households with a venue to follow a tighter portrayal than Society events allow, as they return to participate in the SCA events in their kingdoms. They become inspirations and models for other new members who may have initialy joined because they thought sword fighting was cool, or they liked the chance to have a costume party drinking with a large crowd of friends.

I think it is terribly damaging to both groups to belittle and squabble with each other. The Society is here to stay, and I think Medieval re-enactment is as well. We should try to understand each other and accept our differences. If we do so, we will all benefit in the long run.

Sorry for the rambling thoughts - I hope I have made my ideas at least a little clearer.

The first thing I have to say is: GWEN!?!? A Tuchux? Forgive me for laughing, but the very thought of that made me laugh out loud a bit. No disrespect, it's just the idea... aw, nevermind.

As for SCA/LH: I, personally, am drawn to LH moreso. I also intend to join a tournament company, which seems to me the best wedding of the two. The SCA proper holds no interest for me, as it is not, nor will it ever be, a historical reenactment society. There's nothing wrong with not being a reenactment society...

except for representing yourself as one. I'll only go so far as to say that I, personally, feel it is an abomination that the SCA officially gives "educational demos" that are often ahistorical in every way. And the fact that numerous press releases, recruitment ads, etc. blatantly trumpet the "historical" and "reenactment" qualities of the SCA. This may be true for a very small minority, but taking the SCA as a whole it's... well, it's a falsehood. If unintentional then it is just ignorance, if intentional then it's quite dispicable.

And I think this is where the real conflict comes in: due to this misrepresentation, LH guys have a real disrespect for the SCA, which of course is reciprocated. So, there is a definite tension (if not downright dislike) between the two groups anywhere there is interaction... say, for example, internet discussion boards. The SCA (as a group) wants very badly to be recognized as a living history group (which it is not), rather than a historically based LARP (which it is, but shudders at being referred to as such).

Am I bashing the SCA? It may sound like it, and maybe I am, though it is not intentional. LH has its limitations too, but most LH groups I've met are willing to point out the shortcomings, but the SCA does not, ESPECIALLY in dealing with the public at large, which (along with Bob) is my main problem with them. Though perhaps a great educational group in some cases for its members, the SCA at large is neither equipped nor qualified to do educational demos to those outside the SCA. The problem is that it does these constantly. Which is why LH can never respect them, which is why, in my opinion, the differences are irreconcilable. When AM is at an SCA event, then she's SCA and she's having a ball. When she's at a LH event, she's also having a ball, but of a different color. Ideas and knowledge CAN transfer one to the other, but I think most will agree that they serve to very different purposes. I think each group should stick to its purpose.

Oh, and I agree with everything Bob said.

First off, from what I have read of this forum, I must say that some very knowledgeable individuals reside here, and I am very interested in hanging around and learning from the learned. And, with luck, I’ll be able to find some people who’ll force me to get a little better at my research drive

Anyway, before I get to the main point I want to make, I feel I need to give a bit of background info here, so that my point is better understood. I am currently working on my MA in Humanities, having just recently earned my BA in English. My main interest is in pre-1700 literature, with a special place in my heart for the great warrior epics. (and who can hate Beowulf?) Anyway, any living history group has it’s draws for me, and I wish to participate for the simple reason that I want to be able to draw myself just a bit further into what I love to read. I want to be able to more accurately see what Roland did.

I also come from a background horribly steeped in theatre. God willing and the creek don’t rise; I hope to be an actor at some point in my life. I have been involved in my local theatre groups for the past 9 years, and have been running some of them for the past 7. And trust me, if you think dealing with the LH or SCA egos is tough, work with actors Hell, work with stage managers, they can be worse.

But, closer to the point, it’s been a little over 2 years since I ordered my armour and had my first introductions to the SCA. And after that initial 6-month push, life got in the way, and I have barely had time to strap the armour I waited forever to get. (and thanks to some of chef de chambre’s posts at the Armour Archive, I have been mentally working on my legs for 3 months, I’m going to actually work on them sometime soon : )) To bide my time, and to learn, I’ve kept tabs on the AA, and on various sites with a daily basis. I have stayed out of most of the massive flamewars, and try to think before I talk. Personally, I have the desire to be as authentic as I can, but I will happily admit the inaccuracies in my representation. Rather than go with the standard T-tunic, I have placed an order with Gwen for a historically correct outfit. However, I am going to be wearing my glasses…which is why I choose to be a historically correct SCAer swimming against the tide, than a bad LH member.

Main Point è There are two things that have struck me about this thread and ones like it.

One: there is a very natural tendency to lump all people from a certain group into a stereotype based on a few people. Logicians can tell you why this is wrong (distribution error: ) ) but more importantly, it robs this argument of its main thrust. The minute you take a company like Wolfe Argent, who has 6 members (and 2 horses) listed on it’s website and compare it to a huge organization like the SCA, you immediately have to pare down the SCA to smaller, bite sized chunks. This leads to the logical errors like “the whole of the SCA is only sport minded”. This point has been made in this post, and I want to just state my twist on this. Those in leadership positions or positions of notoriety are often the worst people for the job. When people stereotype others, the stereotype is often based on those in visible positions, and, in my opinion, the worst people to base the opinion off of. Therefore, I would carefully say this: in every group, the lowliest peon is often times better than his master.

Two: any time spent creating a character, be it for re-enactment, performance, or even role-playing is such an intensive and emotional experience that any unwelcome criticisms are going to be immediately met with the strongest resistance. The worst way for someone to criticize an actor is directly. For any changes to take place the actor has to make them, the director needs to carefully and secretly plant the suggestion. What does this mean? Simply put, any sort of negative direct action is suicide in this matter and with the SCA/LH debate. I think the best we can do is strive to be good examples of what we believe in, and hope that others will follow. Oh, yes, and stay out of positions of power : )

Anyway, I just have realized how long winded I’ve been, and I apologize. I haven’t really said anything drastically new, just adding a slightly different twist to some previous viewpoints. Sorry to ramble for so long.

quote:

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Originally posted by Glen K:
<snip>When AM is at an SCA event, then she's SCA and she's having a ball. When she's at a LH event, she's also having a ball, but of a different color.

[This message has been edited by Glen K (edited 09-26-2000).]

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ho there boyo! you dont know me from Adam! how do you know that I'm different at an SCA event than I am at a living history event?

When my household is at an event, whether its an SCA event or a 15th century event, the only difference is that there's more shopping at SCA events, and I didnt have to dig the privvy hole myself.

perhaps I misunderstood your comment?

Yes, I'm in the SCA. Around here, its the closest thing to a medieval venue we got, unless you count The Fantasy Alternative, or the Realm of Chivalry (the folks who got frustrated with the SCA cuz it was too authentic). As Gwen points out, I'm pretty active in the SCA here. Have been for some years. Dont see it changing much, except maybe my focus shifting from the service aspects to the reserach/teaching aspects.

Decided a couple years back to try doing more authentic stuff. Now I'm known as a self proclaimed authenticity nutcase. Folks humor me kindly but dont give me too much grief (funny, the longer they've been in, the harder time they have with it).

anyway, I think my gang is living proof that its perfectly possible to have an SCA household that is into authenticty and have it work fairly well. It takes a lot of cheerleading and disgusting cheerfulness in the face of those who dont get it, but it can work. And we keep gathering more people towards us, many of them new to the game, who see us and think what we're doing is WAY cooler than the costco dayshade/drink till you yark/belly dancers with claymoors thing.

Anyway, I kinda think my point still stands, sorta. What you're doing is living history at an SCA event/venue. You obviously don't do SCA stuff at a living history event (again, I'm guessing here...). And as long as we're (I'm?) on semantics, from what I understand it is you do, you're rather a LH society who participates as an SCA household, rather than an SCA household that does LH events. Kinda like the old adage that a civilized man can act like a barbarian, but the barbarian cannot act like a civilized man (how's that for inflammatory?).

Corey: on second point I'll agree wholeheartedly. The first is generally true, however there are a couple more ramifications to it.

The smallness of a group like Wolfe Argent allows them to do a very specific, slice of history, accurately portrayed history lesson. This is due not so much to their small numbers (everybody wants more people), but to the declared narrowness of the timeframe. Some people claim that the SCA's Jurassic-to-A.D.1600 is it's greatest strength, but I feel that it is their greatest weakness: it completely eliminates the ability to focus. Of course, individual households may focus on a single day in time, but then I would argue they're doing LH within the SCA, not specifically SCA stuff (see my hablando con Anne-Marie above). Another painful thing to remember is that all stereotypes are based in truth; this is especially true with the SCA. It's so big you HAVE to generalize, and the generalizations aren't pretty. Even when the SCA generalizes about itself, what does it say? A "medieval reenactment group" and therein lies the misrepresentation. It's a sticky situation that a pessimist like me sees no solution to.

That's why I want to move to Britain, where the reenactment is good!

Boyohboyohboyohboy... you'd better sign up for some of those European lists than my friend, cause you're definately missing the whole picture.

I got flamed on the Company of St. George list and accused of wasting bandwidth because I wanted to know what they ate for breakfast and how it compared with the historical record. I was told it wasn't important, like tentage, jug shapes, and armour....

If you think the European reenactment community is one big happy family, you're wrong! Most of them won't even deal with us Yanks because they think we're all clueless.

Not all of course, but most.

-1st century AD Romans
-Templars (me!)
-variety of ACW
-Mexican War regulars and milita
-1812 regular, militia, and Highlanders
-WWI American and German
-WWII American HQ unit with jeep, trailer, radios, etc., Brit para, DAK, Italian, and 3rd SS Panzer
-A medical evac group from a nearby National Guard unit

One of the more helpful of the Brits over there is Andy Goddard (of Circa 1265). He occasionally posts to this forum, and has been an invaluable help for sending me the right place for research. Plus, he's one hell of a nice guy. Someday, HG and I will go to Europe to meet him!

The Regia Anglorum people are also moving out of their shell regarding helping us Americans get some proper kit. Talymar is the local U. S. representative for Regia, and is going to Britain to attend the Hastings reenactment. It should be interesting to learn what they find.

There is a pair of Dutch groups that does the period leading up to the battle of Courtrai (LHO and De Klauwaerts). They have people that are helpful and encouraging as well. I also understand that I. G Wolf is that way as well (they study the Hohenstauffens).

But then, my interests tend to be old fashioned...

Robert Coleman, Jr.

Those who beat their swords into plowshare end up plowing for those who don't.

you wrote:

<<I also understand that I. G Wolf is that way as well (they study the Hohenstauffens).>>

If you find out more regarding this, let me know! Much of my family came from this area (southwestern germany-swabia) and we think possibly served at or may have helped supply their fortress Hohen-twiel.

Thanks!!!

FvH