I realize this is a little out of the scope of this board, but hopefully someone with more expertise can assist me. I was perusing the 16th century household listing of Henry Algernon Percy 5th Earl of Northumberland and came across this:

quote:

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1. Groom of the Stirrup 1. - Groom of the Palfreys 1. Groom Sumpterman 1. and Groom of the Chariot. 1.

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Does anyone think I'm correct (or at least on the right track) with the following assumptions of job description?

• Groom of the Stirrup - Groom in charge of tacking up mounts, the tack itself and its repair? Or perhaps the "Head Boy" to use a more modern term?
• Groom of the Palfreys - Groom charged with the care of the good riding horses
• Groom Sumpterman - I'm assuming this to be the groom in charge of the care of the "heavy horses" used for moving things since sumpter was a term often used to refer to a draft or pack horse. I thought perhaps also for the heavy agricultural horses, but I still think oxen might have been a more popular choice for this periods agricultural work.
• Groom of the Chariot - the person who looks after the carriages/wagons? Carriages were not highly developed yet but this certainly seems to indicate they were in use.

Any thoughts, input, other suggested reading sources anyone might have will be most appreciated!

Be well,
Ace

I think we have to look at the term "groom". In this case I think Groom refers to any of the officers (Groom Officers) of an English Royal household.

If you take the others in the listing:

Grooms and Groom Officers of the Household 20 - viz. Grooms of the Chamber 5. As to say 3 ride with my Lord and one bide at home and one for my Lady - Grooms of the Wardrobe 3 viz. Groom of the Robes 1. Groom of the Beds 1. Groom of the Wardrobe for my Lady 1. - Groom of the Ewery 1. Groom of the Pantry 1. Groom of the Cellar 1. - Groom of the Buttery 1. - Grooms of the Kitchen 2 viz. a Groom for the mouth and a groom for the Larder Groom of the Hall 1. Groom Porter 1. Groom of the Stirrup 1. - Groom of the Palfreys 1. Groom Sumpterman 1. and Groom of the Chariot.

I think you are on the right track, though I wonder if the "Groom of the Stirrup" refers specifically to the man that tends to the lord's horse or he could be the "head" man for all stable activities.

Perhaps looking for the term "Butler" would help in finding more information as I have heard several of the above "groom" titles referred to as butler. example: "Butler of the Pantry" and the like.

Good luck.

Jenn

[ 08-29-2002: Message edited by: Fire Stryker ]

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Jenn

Castles of Britain

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quote:

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I think we have to look at the term "groom". In this case I think Groom refers to any of the officers (Groom Officers) of an English Royal household.

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I'm aware of that but I was concentrating pretty much on the grooms I felt would be associated with the horses.

Good point about the "Groom of the Stirrup"--I wonder if the hunting tradition of the stirrup cup has anything to do with that? OT and definitely OOP for this board, but something I will have to look into for fun's sake.

Thanks for the other link too--going to check it out, work is actually slow today.

Oh and yes, that was the link I was looking at! Jeez, you have to know all the good spots

I'm vaguely surprised about a job that ISN'T on the list, since there doesn't seem to be a Groom in charge of the Warhorses.

Other large and / or Royal households often seem to break down responsibility between a groom of the Palfreys and a groom of the Destriers

Given Northumberland's stable (I remember from other documents that he has a number of hunting and war horses at this point), I'm quite surprised that isn't the case here, unless of course that is what the groom of the stirrup does. Makes you wonder who IS responsible for them.

"Groom of the Chariot" - specificaly the man in charge of driving and maintaining the lord's Chariot or carriage, and presumably the associated horses (eight of them, in northumberland's case, I believe). I don't think he would be responsible for other cartage, which would probably come under the Sumpterman - I can't prove it in this case, but it'd be a more logical distribution of duties, putting one man in charge of the baggage, and he is the groom of the chariot, not chariotS - Northumberland has only one chariot at this point, I believe, but a number of other carts.

If you're interested in transport arrangements, there's a good section on moving the household around in CM Woolgar, "The Great Household in Medieval England"

Thanks so much for the input and the other reference.

Actually, now that you mention it, it is odd that a Palfrey groom is specifically designated when one for Warhorses isn't. Perhaps that is the Groom of the Stirrup does, since that position is mentioned first, I'm hoping that indicates it as the most important "stable groom" position.

Long weekend, time to do some reading