Honest opinions are welcome and encouraged.

Mike

Nice looking breastplate. It looks to be inspired by the effigy of Konrad von Bickenbach, or possibly the tournament effigy of Johann I. von Wertheim.
What time period and nationality are you aiming for? It's hard to give critique without that info. From the breastplate I would say Germanic, about 1400.

Comments;
-The wings on the poleyns are too big.
-The lames on the elbow, as well as possibly the spaulder, seem too wide.
-Your mail sleeves should extend futher to protect the area not covered by your upper cannon (I presume you will be completing the vambrace once money allows.)
-You will need a standing mail collar at the neck, either attached to the shirt or part of a mantle as you said you would be adding.
-You will need an appropriate jupon or coat armour to complete the look.

I hope the rest of the armour is not too long off.

I plan on getting atleast some half gauntlets. Now as long as I dont get my fingers destroyed during fighting.

I am going for late 14th century Italian actually. Specifically Italian condottiere if I can pass it off.

quote:

---

-The wings on the poleyns are too big.

---

quote:

---

-The lames on the elbow, as well as possibly the spaulder, seem too wide.

---

quote:

---

-Your mail sleeves should extend futher to protect the area not covered by your upper cannon (I presume you will be completing the vambrace once money allows.)

---

quote:

---

-You will need a standing mail collar at the neck, either attached to the shirt or part of a mantle as you said you would be adding.

---

quote:

---

posted 04-18-2006 03:31 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey Mike,
Nice looking breastplate. It looks to be inspired by the effigy of Konrad von Bickenbach, or possibly the tournament effigy of Johann I. von Wertheim.
What time period and nationality are you aiming for? It's hard to give critique without that info. From the breastplate I would say Germanic, about 1400.

Comments;
-The wings on the poleyns are too big.
-The lames on the elbow, as well as possibly the spaulder, seem too wide.
-Your mail sleeves should extend futher to protect the area not covered by your upper cannon (I presume you will be completing the vambrace once money allows.)
-You will need a standing mail collar at the neck, either attached to the shirt or part of a mantle as you said you would be adding.
-You will need an appropriate jupon or coat armour to complete the look.

---

The completion of the armour will be when I can sell enough stuff on ebay to offset the cost. I had a much better kit, but during changing of duty stations in the Army and pieces walking off during demos whittled it down to virtually nothing.

I want to look as authentic as possible. Not only just for my sake, but for spectators during fight demos and talks.

Thanks for the help so far!

quote:

---

-You will need an appropriate jupon or coat armour to complete the look.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
Oops, I screwed the last quote up. It should have been this

Can you elaborate on this as to what would be appropriate?

---

Specifically, it would be the jupon of whichever noble house you belong to - so for example if you were a Douglas, it would bear their coat of arms, or if you were a Lancastrian one of theirs.

What kind of helmet are you going for?

-Jason

--------------------

~ Jason Banditt Adams
Illustrator for the gaming industry
www.Rogue-Artist.com

The breastplate was only $100 due to the seller having it for 5 years and never getting it strapped. The stop rib was from extra crap I had sitting around the garage and didnt cost a dime.

The elbows and spaulders total was around $120.

The legs were around $140.

The hauberk took me on and off about a year to make that of course just cost me materials and a lot of time.

The gambeson that cannot really be seen was around $70.

So total, around $430 (not counting mail materials) Not bad I guess.

It used to have an attached coif, but I removed it.

Please dont comment on how silly I look with the extra long gambeson underneath or for anything else really! :OP

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
<sigh> let me try this again. I posted a big long response and lost it.

---

Oh. That's really annoying! My sympathies..

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
I am going for late 14th century Italian actually. Specifically Italian condottiere if I can pass it off.

---

What social position? Mounted, knight, well armed mercinary, foot?
There were are large number of foreign knights and minor nobles working as mercinaries in Italy in the 14th century, mostly from Germany, England and Hungary if I recall correctly, so you could wear armour from outside the region or a mix.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
I plan on getting at least some half gauntlets.

---

I haven't come across any evidence that half-gauntlets were in use in the 14th century. If you are going for authenticity, they will most likely not be able to be justified.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
Can you elaborate on this as to what would be appropriate?

---

Regarding Jupons and coat armours, they were an essential part of knightly military dress in most parts of Europe, although I am not so familar with their use in Italy.
The hotter climate seems to have made them dress more lightly, and I don't recall any coat armours beind depicted in art from Italy. A thin, loose, short sleeved garment reaching approximately mid thigh seems to have been commonly worn over the armour in the late 14th and early 15th century by the Italian knights. Jupons seem to have also been in use.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
I want to look as authentic as possible.

---

Excellent!! You may want to look at art from the area to see what they were wearing. This effigy of Restaino Caldora in Sulmona, from the early 15th century, shows a knight with an armour similar to what you are putting together. Notice the mail over upper cannon, a feature that seems to me to show up regularly in Italy.
The circle on the breastplate was drawn in by me to show where the broken off lance rest was located.
Notice also that he is wearing a cape and a cover over the front of the groin and upper legs, which possible also extends over the breastplate.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Mike Mercier:
Im planning on getting a houndskull. In the meantine, despite being a little later period I found a barbute for very cheap

---

Barbute-like bascinets were not uncommon in late 14th century Italy, so you may get away with a 15th century barbute till you get one of a more correct type.

Thanks for the info on the half-gauntlets. Since I cant justify that, I will stay away.

This set from Valentine is what I was aiming. http://www.varmouries.com/tran_01.html

Am I correct in thinking that the mercenary/militia/condottiere would not have worn a jupon since I wouldnt be associated with any house?

The mounted troops, especially knights, seem to have always had good leg armour and are often depicted with visored bascinets. They were also the first to adopt the white (uncovered) armour as you have it.

Your armour seems to be more akin to that of a mounted unit, a well armoured one at that.
The valentine armour is copied from extant pieces at Churburg (except the spaulders), and represent knightly armour.

The jupon was often worn with a CoP or under/over breastplates and is basically a tight fitting garment, often thought to have been leather.
Although knights often had them embroidered or painted in their colours, they are often also depicted in a single colour and there are no rules stating they can only be warn with 'house colours", heraldry and such.

Would braies and chausses be the standard garment for under the leg armour?

The braies of the late 14th century had become much smaller than those worn even earlier in the century. At the end of the 14th century they seem to have worn boxer short type braies.

Cloth chausses (hose) are a must.
Mail chausses were pretty much out by the later 14th century, although no-one as far as I know has found any proof that the mail sometimes seen at joints in plate leg armour, or arm armour for that matter, were just inserts and not chausses or sleeves.

:O)