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Author Topic: Appropriate finish/seal for a longbow?
Amhlaidgh
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posted 10-19-2005 12:15 PM     Profile for Amhlaidgh     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I just bought a new longbow, specifically unfinished because the bowyer uses a polyurethane sealer. What was done in period to seal/finish a bow? Did this change over the period of the longbow's ascendancy?

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Martin
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posted 10-19-2005 04:16 PM     Profile for Martin     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Hi,
try beeswax or linseed oil was a widely used product on wood, shouldn´t have any effect on the funtioning of your bow.
Martin

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Knechte de Freiheit
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posted 03-03-2006 03:48 AM     Profile for Knechte de Freiheit     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
To seal a longbow the
agents for waterproofing a bow
1. Beeswax a coat of paste heat it up a little put it on at it used for protect longbows in England

2: animal fat the ancient way old is the good way (deer fat, bear fat or good old pig-bacon grease)
Rubbed in by hand needs friction to make it penetrate the bow placed in a warm space some oils may bleed out so put a pan or the like under it put several coats on the bow at first. Add more coats two time a year.
Dogs will like the bow and may take and eat or runoff with so lookout.
This would look cool to do at a LH camp life for Tommy Longbowman could make Incendiary Arrows in the field from that bacon grease too or to help him down that basic soldiers’ food “its Bacon”.

3: Linseed oil it required a lager number of very many costs to be effective.

4: Spirit varnish made from pitch from cedar or pine & can be fruits trees where the sap oozes cut of a damaged (this is fun hit it with a axe’s Yes Hahahaha) on the trunk .
Gather the pitch and dried the pitch until hard uses a pestle & mortar to crushed in to a fine power put it in to a glass add rubbing alcohol (but Vodka date~1450’s works to) stir mix over a 24 hrs.to dissolve uses a old T-shirt to strain it in to another glass the varnish is a golden amber in color.
Apply with a cotton cloth into the varnish then rub it into the bow Make Sure To Cover All Of The Bow you may half to take off the wrap handle and varnish under the handle as uneven moisture protection is very bad worse than no moisture protection at all.
First coat dyes some what fast when varnish is totally dry apply another coat dry time takes longer and longer as you apply coats 3 or 4 if you put 7or 8 will gives a gloss look but as not glossy like polyurethanes.

Hope this helps you
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gregory23b
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posted 03-05-2006 10:44 AM     Profile for gregory23b   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
melt beeswax with a small amount of boiled linseed oil, this will give you a thickish paste. Rub it in, it will buff up and form a hard and reasonably water resistant coat. This is also not a bad bowstring mixture.

or you could use beeswax and turpentine spirit, this allows greater penetration of the wood and is quicker but does not leave as much of a coating.

You have a number of options as mentioned.

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Boudhewein
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posted 03-05-2006 04:42 PM     Profile for Boudhewein     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Soemwhere, a fictional book about a English archer in de hundred year war, I readthat use of charcoal/beeswax mixture to colour a bow dark. Anyone with experience with this?

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Knechte de Freiheit
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posted 03-06-2006 04:33 AM     Profile for Knechte de Freiheit     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Because rain and wooden bows do not mix well at all and some Bowyer’s would cove there all-weather bows with finish containing a varnish made pure oil finishes such as linseed oil and tung oil Master Bowyer Paul Comstock and he published a book called the Bent Stick he can be reached at P.O. Box 1102, Delaware, OH 43015.
He gives the oil finishes low marks Paul saying they “failed me badly when faced with water”.
Master Bowyer John Strunk’ of the Spirit Longbow Company he can be reached at 5513 Third Street, Tillamook, OR, 97141 and for Bowyer class to. John said on oil finishes “Didn’t protect the bow from a good day in the rain.

Look oil finishes is a complicated process of heating tree resins (the Bow)& linseed oil at high temp over long a time this a bowyer job like a armor or sword maker it’s not like you can just order a unfinished bow then rub some linseed oil on it & put a little beeswax I hope to have moisture protection.
Oil finishes I say it’s makes for Dam good a gunstocks finishes and makes the bow look good but that about all it good for but it no good at stopping moisture Looks don’t out water.

I have had seen a ~36# longbow break and parted wood the guy shooting the was ok I had shot the bow and looked over the day before it was a American flat longbow made of yew oil finishes & waxed a very lovely little bow perfect wood but over night the dew got on the bow the next morning the guy wiped off the water it parted wood on the 1st shot.
This is why I put 2 or 3 cost of home-made with mineral spirits cover it with beeswax over the bow I’m making its good to put beeswax on after shooting a waxy bow is a good bow.

One more thing is leather grip on the handle leather soaks up water like a sponge it stays wet for hours there are no finish to prevent this.
But cane handle like the type use in weave seats you know the rattan type.
Wrap cord or tie on suede as you can untie it later a wipe off your bow down and wax it.

A wooden longbow is not a lance so don’t break it.

It’s only a flesh wound


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gregory23b
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posted 03-06-2006 08:11 AM     Profile for gregory23b   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Ideally a bow should not have a grip at all, many do because they are made form two joined billets.

Oils on their own do not form crusts that easily, but oil and beeswax do, or spirit and beeswax, the solvency of the wax in oil gives it penetration and the wax gives a crust.

Kitchen job making a wax and linseed paste, a jam jar job for turps and wax, put enough turps over wax to cover it, leave for a few days until wax and turps have combined, rub on, the looser the paste the more layers you will need, but that is better than just the one.

Plus it smells lovely.

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Knechte de Freiheit
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posted 03-06-2006 01:54 PM     Profile for Knechte de Freiheit     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Yes most of the art work of time shows no handle at all but the 21c.bowyer put's handle so now the Medieval Longbowman must have them (NO) must Bowyer's do not market to the guy do LH of Cheshire archer there market is traditonal shooters they just started geting more to market us.
Geting a mail order you miss out on bow controll of Design and performance a bow shoud fit the shooter there are some poorly made longbows out there I seen splintered backs new out of the box have to fix a new bow is out of line.

One more thing we LH types bowman need to do is have Archer Tournaments open to Traditional Bows have a dress code (run it like the Jousts Tournaments the good one like scottland)and have prize like a bow for top shooter and 2nd & 3rd some HE arrows & heads if we start it we can controll it I know there some Traditional Archer Sport Shooter who would jump in to the hobby as well some SCA who wound put wool on.

Your Mother is a hamster and your farther smells of Elderberries

[ 03-06-2006: Message edited by: Knechte de Freiheit ]


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Thomas james hayman
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posted 03-06-2006 05:05 PM     Profile for Thomas james hayman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
There is a traditonal bow tournament of osrt sheld ecah year here in the UK. It is the antient Scorton silver arrow and is open to yorkshiremen and their longbows. Others can shoot but can't take prizes i'm afraid. Something like that on an international level would be cool.

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Knechte de Freiheit
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posted 03-06-2006 05:55 PM     Profile for Knechte de Freiheit     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Ok but in the USA we have no good traditional bow tournaments here (I forgot this forum goes out side the US forgive me). Most SCA & some medieval groups bow tourn here in US are open to all classes the Fiberglass and aluminum arrows are used here I'd like to see this END if some one start.

I know the UK has a long tradition in wooden bows & custom arrows shafts we in the US had one before Fred Bare poisoned the well here with all the glass bows and aluminum arrows.


quote:
Originally posted by Thomas james hayman:
There is a traditonal bow tournament of osrt sheld ecah year here in the UK. It is the antient Scorton silver arrow and is open to yorkshiremen and their longbows. Others can shoot but can't take prizes i'm afraid. Something like that on an international level would be cool.

TJH yes 100% on Targit.
Do you have the rules for that Scorton silver arrow tournament I'd to see them.

A nods as good as a wink to a blind bat
god I can't speel
[ 03-06-2006: Message edited by: Knechte de Freiheit ]

[ 03-06-2006: Message edited by: Knechte de Freiheit ]

[ 03-07-2006: Message edited by: Knechte de Freiheit ]


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Thomas james hayman
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posted 03-06-2006 06:25 PM     Profile for Thomas james hayman   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
You could set up your own tournament?? well, there's a lot more to it than that but it's a possibility?

As for rules, check the Scorton site http://www.scortonarrow.com/

I was there a couple of years ago watching (too young to shoot) and it's a fun event. email me at thomas.hayman@gmail.com if you want to chat more on it, we're going a bit off topic here :-)
http://www.scortonarrow.com/vol06/2004/TR2004.htm
those are the scores for when it was held at our club. My dad came an abismal 42nd

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gregory23b
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posted 03-06-2006 07:09 PM     Profile for gregory23b   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Years ago the Order of the Black Prince - based at Dover castle used to hold an annual archery festival, open to guests, had to be in medieval kit, prizes for performance as well as dress.

I also initiated an extra prize, the worst shot of the competition >>-----> ie had an awkward angle and basically hit a tree branch and my arrow splintered into at least three pieces, it was as much my use of Anglo Saxon and jumping up and down that got me the 'prize', which was half an arrow shaft embedded into a piece of tree. The branch still had green leaves on it. I can't remember if I won it the second year, but the second year's prize was a steam bent shaft - corkscrew shape.


Also the town of Le Puy en Velay resurrected the Fetes de roi de loiseau - an old archery festival dating back to the 16thC. I think it is guest invite only, we had some people shoot in it, but we were part of the bigger festival surrounding the archery competition.

I was better at shooting man sized targets with blunts, something worth hitting>>------>

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Knechte de Freiheit
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posted 03-07-2006 01:25 AM     Profile for Knechte de Freiheit     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
We have moved away from the subjuct of finish but this still it's a good subjuct it at this time my job The War will not let me / keep me from set up set up of my own tournament as I'd like to do this but 10 yrs. of sitting back and looking is killing me I must do some thing like speek out on the subjuct may be some one here in the US will run with the ball come on team USA.

[ 03-07-2006: Message edited by: Knechte de Freiheit ]

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Diana Peterson
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posted 03-07-2006 11:47 AM     Profile for Diana Peterson   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
I wanted to add something on the subject of animal grease for a finish...

Having experimented with the myriad uses of goose grease, I'm a bit of a convert. It has several advantages over other rendered fats:

It does not go rancid, apparently, ever.
It has no real discernable odor.
It's long wearing.

To make it, we take goose oil left over from our Yule feasts (we have huge tubs of it), strain particles out of it, and boil it in a vat with at least equal parts water for a few hours. After that, chill it for a day or two, and skim off the white soft paste from the top. (Throw the rest out.)

That's the stuff to use for nearly anything you want to treat with rendered fat. I've used it on my turnshoes, tested it on a maille shirt which we left out in the rain for four months (it did well!) and it was also apparently used as a base for salves and lotions 'back in the day.'

Can't say enough good things about it.

---Diana---


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gregory23b
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posted 03-07-2006 02:11 PM     Profile for gregory23b   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Nice one Diana. Fits in with a medieval recipe for using chicken fat to protect armour from rust.

The recipe does not mention rendering, which in my mind is essential, otherwise....bzz.

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Knechte de Freiheit
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posted 03-07-2006 11:14 PM     Profile for Knechte de Freiheit     Send New Private Message   Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Yes Diana goose is a good one and to goose the subject along I go off subjuct goose feather make for one of the best fletching for arrow they hold up well wet & protected some what from water just take full-length feather slit w/ a sharp knife then the bases are ground flat by sanding then tying on feather w/ sinew hide glue on to the arrow shaft.

I still can't speel

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yeomanbowman
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posted 06-19-2006 04:37 PM     Profile for yeomanbowman     Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote
Hello All,
Sir John Smyth in 1590 writes of archers heating a mixture of bees’ wax, tallow and rosin to make a rubbing paste (applied via a woollen cloth) as a bow's protection against the elements. This mix is also recommended for the string. Roger Ascham's slightly earlier (1544) advice, via 'Toxophilus' is similar. However, I have not heard of how arrows were weather 'proofed' only how the fletches were stuck on and whipped. Has anyone heard of a historical reference for this?

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